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Best guitarist of all time?
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Who do u think is the best?

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[guitardude] Monday, February 16, 2009 7:59:40 PM 
Frank Marino and Mahogany Rush, damn what a flashback that invoked!! I remember sittng in music class in 5th grade and this kid brought in one of Mahogany Rush`s albums to play on our Freebee Friday, what a musical menagerie. I don`t remember  these really long guitar solo`s with lot`s of wah pedal!! damn, maybe it wasn`t EVH that got me to pick up the guitar.   [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by flashrockinman from Friday, February 06, 2009 9:47:14 PM)
Edited at: Monday, February 16, 2009 8:00:07 PM
[flashrockinman] Monday, February 16, 2009 3:36:02 PM 
dude, what can i say,  montrose was ahead of his time.    get on your bad motor scooter and ride....................................
[Luvers666] Tuesday, February 10, 2009 8:02:38 PM 

Ronnie Montrose is EXTREMELY underrated, but then again so is Criss Oliva.

Criss is one of those guitarists who nothing can be sad about. His guitar style, tone, sound and structure started a revolution that other guitar players clearly emulated.

[flashrockinman] Friday, February 06, 2009 9:47:14 PM 
ok,since all u guys must have fallen asleep at the wheel, lets talk about  jimmy page,ronnie montrose,roth,frankie marino.  you must have something to say about one of these rockers?
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Wednesday, January 28, 2009 8:19:18 AM 
I only have one Iced Earth CD (Something Wicked).  Good stuff.
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by flashrockinman from Wednesday, January 28, 2009 7:53:52 AM)
[flashrockinman] Wednesday, January 28, 2009 7:53:52 AM 
wow, this is what i call feedback,  i'm on a classic rock mission it seems with the help of utube.  grave digger, iced earth, baron rojo..................... oh, who's baron rojo? a spanish hard rock band that does  difficult to cure by rainbow.  u have to see it. although sound quality is so so. they call themselves heavy metal.  again love to hear the feedback.  and your right blackmore is a great guitarist and an ass. 
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Wednesday, January 28, 2009 5:20:31 AM 

I'm sorry if I came across as annoyed, Ron.  I didn't understand that particular comment, that's all.  My apologies. is my friend, as it's the best place to go find new and old cd's outside of eBay IMO.

JPJ goes, I don't think he wanted to get back into the thick of playing gigs again.  He makes a decent living as a producer now from what I last read.

  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Wednesday, January 28, 2009 5:15:59 AM)
[ron h] Wednesday, January 28, 2009 5:15:59 AM 
I don't mean to raise your ire DP, Whitesnake did make 'some' really good music, but in doing so I think they could have been 'great'...One thing I have a hard time with is 'my perception' that Coverdale was trying too hard to be Plant...though I think the Coverdale/Page colaboration did a lot to get Plant back in the mix (albeit leaving JP Jones out!!)...all in all , a lot of money, a lot of girls (though Tawny bit him in the ass in the end), no need to be great...I haven't heard any newer Snake in a long time, and I would check it out (out of curiosity, if you insist)...
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Darth_Painkiller_0870 from Wednesday, January 28, 2009 4:55:32 AM)
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Wednesday, January 28, 2009 4:55:32 AM 
I love Whitesnake!  Define how they should get "serious" though?  Considering their last disc Good To Be Bad is really nice and fun to listen too. 
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Wednesday, January 28, 2009 4:39:37 AM)
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Wednesday, January 28, 2009 4:53:29 AM 
The only song on Machine Head that can even be considered Metal is Highway Star.  Machine Head is a damned fine Hard Rock album.  Period.  Blackmore is a fucking guitar genius, but a huge asshole imo.
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Wednesday, January 28, 2009 4:32:24 AM)
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Wednesday, January 28, 2009 4:51:42 AM 
Manowar is pretty good.  They take awhile to grow on you though.  It's a shame they don't any airplay, but that's the commonwealth of Pennsylvania for you.
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by flashrockinman from Tuesday, January 27, 2009 1:36:09 PM)
[ron h] Wednesday, January 28, 2009 4:39:37 AM 
David Coverdale, you can't argue with his pipes!!  When I first heard Whitesnake, I thought they were a modern day rip-off of Zep...I think they were good enough, if they ever decided to get serious, to be a really good band, but like many other 'potentials' before and since, they will be known for what they were, another band who capitalized on the backs of others!!

...I saw King Diamond once on his 'Them' tour, would have loved to have seen 'Abigail'...I personally think he was under rated, but you either like his music or you don't, there's no middle ground with him...
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by flashrockinman from Tuesday, January 27, 2009 1:36:09 PM)
[ron h] Wednesday, January 28, 2009 4:32:24 AM 
If I was gonna give a class on the history of Metal, Machine Head would be mandatory listening!!!  Maybe that is one of the reasons I posted Richie Blackmore as the greatest guitarist of all I think so because of his actual playing??  Perhaps in part, but his (and the band's) influence is truly great!!
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Darth_Painkiller_0870 from Tuesday, January 27, 2009 5:26:02 AM)
[flashrockinman] Tuesday, January 27, 2009 1:36:09 PM 
which brings up the band white snake .  he's got the voice. deep purple stormbringer is a classic. of course i'm talking about coverdale.  but white snake to me is a chick hard rock band. not metal.  deep purple to me are the founders of hard rock.  you metioned machinehead.  that album started it all.  sooooooooo many good tracks on that ablum still played on the radio today.

so many people talk about man of war.   they don't get any air play.  but there are people out there  that swear that the band is the greatest metal band  blah blah blah................  so i bought an album hoping to be blown away.   sorry  wasn't that impressed.  it looked like a cartoon of four guys  dressed as worriors on the cover in a row. a couple tracks where alright but, not what i was expecting.  king diamond's band to me was much better  melissa.  but nobody mentions them
Edited at: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 1:44:32 PM
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Tuesday, January 27, 2009 5:26:02 AM 
After Machine Head, Perfect Strangers is my favorite DP album (studio-wise).  It's difficult to find some of the other studio stuff from the Purple other than compilations though.

And that the time, kicking Ozzy out of Sabbath made sense.  But Sabbath isn't that good with Ian Gillian or Kevin Martin on vocals.  No offense to them b/c they have great voices, but Ozzy & Dio are in a separate class.  They are metal vocalists, while Ian's fits best with DP's style of hard rock, and Kevin Martin...

  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Tuesday, January 27, 2009 5:05:46 AM)
[ron h] Tuesday, January 27, 2009 5:05:46 AM 
I hate to say it, but I think kicking Ozzy out was the best thing for all...Sabbath became an even bigger monster and Ozzy's '80 release catapaulted him into a new dimension as well (thanks in part to Randy Rhodes, thanks Quiet Riot!!)...Maidens debut was awesome as well, but still a couple of years away from the machine they became!!  Heaven and Hell is one of my favorite albums to date, it is timeless in my minds eye!!!!!  What do you think of Deep Purples '84 release of 'Perfect Strangers'??  To me, it's another great album!!!
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Darth_Painkiller_0870 from Tuesday, January 27, 2009 4:37:15 AM)
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Tuesday, January 27, 2009 4:37:15 AM 

Sabbath's Technical Ectasy was a disaster.  They won't play anything off that album.  Never Say Die ('78 - Ozzy's last disc with Sabbath) is really good IMO.  Never Say Die! itself is a rather uplifting track.  The band went and found Dio and put out the classic Heaven & Hell CD - which I think is just as hard and heavy as British Steel and Maiden's debut in 80.  Kiss got sucked into the disco scene and put out Dynasty and Unmasked.  I will give Kiss points for trying to do a concept album.  I think that while Music From "The Elder" could've been a lot better, it's also where Kiss expanded their sound from Hard Rock and made their brief transition to Metal.

  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Tuesday, January 27, 2009 4:14:50 AM)
[ron h] Tuesday, January 27, 2009 4:14:50 AM 
In retrospect probably not, but at the time I think the term 'Acid Rock' would fit??  That's a term you don't hear much these days but was thrown around regularly at the time...again, the lines have blurred through time and I certainly can't argue (and won't) that Sabbath isn't Metal, because they are, I just don't think they started out as what I would call Metal today...

...Metal, as a genre, encompasses all forms of Metal...the Godfathers of Metal would be Sabbath as they were the influence of the Metal Gods themselves, and even though we agree that Zep is not Metal, you can hear their influence in some of Priests early music as well, but they were never Metal, whereas Sabbath, the Dio years, picked up on the musical style of Metal...

...Paranoid, Sweet Leaf, Iron Man and many others definately were the standards at the time, nothing compared to 'em...but the genre was just beginning and throughout most of the 70's Hard Rock picked up steam and that is where it stayed...then Punk made a splash and then Disco came on the scene...where was Sabbath?  Zep?  Kiss?  Maiden wasn't even born yet!!...

...Then came along a little old album called British Steel, gee, what happened next??...
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Darth_Painkiller_0870 from Tuesday, January 27, 2009 3:55:19 AM)
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Tuesday, January 27, 2009 3:55:19 AM 
Ron, do you own Black Sabbath's Sabbath Bloody Sabbath, Paranoid or Sabotage CD's?  How about Black Sabbath and Master Of Reality?  These are not particularly progressive (save for certain instances), but rather they are dark, foreboding, and have a certain driving power that most bands still try emulating in the 21st century.  These are definite proof positive that Black Sabbath of the 70's belongs in the Metal category.  Good examples of Prog Rock are King Crimson, Rush, Pink Floyd and Queensryche.  Dream Theater too.  Aside from heavy riffs and such...these bands have zero in common with Judas Priest and Black Sabbath.  It's like trying to compare ZZ Top and the Allman Brothers - the only thing they have in common is that they're from the South.
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Monday, January 26, 2009 6:22:52 PM)
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Tuesday, January 27, 2009 3:44:38 AM 
I agree flash.  But Rush has always been a progressive-sounding band.  Look at them from a purely lyrical aspect.  Alot of their lyrics are centered around unusual themes (like Sabbath, King Crimson and a host of others).  However, I lost interest in Rush after the 2112 album.  Most of their songs were too weird and I couldn't relate to a lot of it anyway (seriously, who gives a crap about Bastille Day other than the French?).  I only own Rush's Retrospective 1974-80 because of this.  One of my co-workers lent me their last studio recording, and it was nothing I could really get into from a lyrical standpoint.  Whereas, I could relate to a lot of Black Sabbath's music - regardless of who's on vocals.  Sabbath's music is just more interesting and powerful.

Ron, Sabbath absolutely terrified me when I bought Paranoid and listened to Planet Caravan.  That song gave me nightmares for a week when I was a teen!  I stopped buying their other stuff until I heard Changes and Black Sabbath on Ozzy's Live & Loud CD.  From there, I guess you can say my journey towards the dark side had begun?  

  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by flashrockinman from Monday, January 26, 2009 10:36:36 PM)
[flashrockinman] Monday, January 26, 2009 10:36:36 PM 

ok, another band with another story. there first 4 albums, or 8 tracks. where hard. then the next two where alittle hard, you could tell they where going a different direction with their music.  than instead of going back to their roots, they went commerical.  they got progressive.   they are still a ok band, but what if they started playing metal.   this band you can guess   RUSH   they are rockers but to me there just rush. dare to be different. some of their ablums really suck too.  to bad.  (also have memories it the back seat of an oldsmoble delta 88 with all worlds astage  blasting)

[ron h] Monday, January 26, 2009 6:22:52 PM 
Hey there DP...seems we pretty much agree on everything except on Sabbath, and I'm certainly not gonna tell you you're wrong!!!  Of all the bands we've been discussing here lately, Sabbath would be the one band I would give a free pass to and here's why...

...when Sabbath came out they had a sound unlike any other and for a reason well documented (fingertips cut off), if it wasn't for that (?fortunate?) accident, who knows what they would have sounded like, who cares, it happend!! was dark, dreary, evil sounding music, and it either scared the sh*t out of you or rocked you... but to me it's more about the lyrics for 70's Sabbath that would give them the edge over other bands, not so much what the music sounded like as compared to Metal as we've grown to know Sabbath of the 80's and on are Metal, not what I would consider progressive rock, which I guess is where I put Sabbath and early Priest in, a Hard/Prog Rock category...for me, I believe it was Priest with their British Steel album to be the very first, front to back Heavy Metal album...

DP, I am biased as I'm sure you're very well aware of...if anything, Priest is the band that I measure every other band against, and maybe that's not fair, but it's what works for me...
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Darth_Painkiller_0870 from Monday, January 26, 2009 5:10:04 AM)
[guitardude] Monday, January 26, 2009 4:30:54 PM 
Cerwin-Vegas, Sparkomatics...OMG!! Now that caused a serious flashback!!!!
Wild Dogs had a song called "Rockin and Rollin" that song has such a driving guitar riff, I can still hear it in my head. And I haven`t actually heard the thing in over two decades!!! Power Lover holds a fond memory for me. My girlfriend at the time  , was a rocker chick, when she heard Power Lover for the first time, she tried to hurt me!!  No pun intended, that song pumped her up so much!!!....... Let`s see , what was her number again?
Edited at: Monday, January 26, 2009 4:32:28 PM
[flashrockinman] Monday, January 26, 2009 3:49:29 PM 
oh yes.......... the rods............they are a spin off . feinstein was a member of a band called  elf  second album (last ablum) the band broke up.  of course the lead singer of elf was dio.  you know his story.  the rods music is on utube. you should start off on power lover.  the wild dogs album is an import now, good luck finding that one. let them eat metal , i didn't think that abum was that great.    feinstein also has some solo stuff out there also.    so crank you cerwin vegas , or sparkomatics,  what ever you got , and rock hard.   flash
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Monday, January 26, 2009 2:45:58 PM 

I don't mean to get your britches all twisted with my lack of more comprehensive knowledge of Triumph.  They don't get any airplay in Philadelphia, and the most I've heard are the aforementioned songs from my satellite radio subscription.

As for the difference between Hard Rock and Metal....How is that difficult?  I agree that VH is not and never was Metal, but everyone is different and has different perceptions.  

  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Luvers666 from Monday, January 26, 2009 10:26:58 AM)
[Luvers666] Monday, January 26, 2009 10:26:58 AM 
I fail to see the difference between HARD ROCK and METAL. Now Heavy Metal has an identity all it's own, there are elements to it that you can find in no other genre, same with Death Metal, Country, Disco, Opera. But regular Metal and HARD ROCK or HEAVY Rock is the same thing. Pioneering Heavy Metal bands that we call that nowadays was referred as Hard Rock until the 1980's. I mean the first time I ever heard a band called Heavy Metal was Van Halen, in 1982 and that was by a fan, who I would not lump into the genre.

As far as Triumph goes, the band themselves have stated hundreds of times that they never threw themselves into the genre because they didn't want to be categorized, since they felt it limited what a band could do. Mike Levine even once said they were a band who belongs in the "Music Genre". It is also hard to place them in Metal because the majority of their songs are more upbeat and are about inspiration, but that is only to those who believe they have 'Three Weak Ass Songs'. Triumph's first two albums feature topics like Murder, Drug Lords, Smuggling, Torture, Prostituion, Destruction, Partying, Domestic Violence, Abuse.

And what else is funny is when Triumph introduced the idea of complete CONCEPT ALBUM in the Metal genre, they did the one thing that no one this side of the Who and Savatage ever did, they actually made their lone concept album a story about the future. If you listen to the bands seventh album, THUNDER SEVEN, it describes in grave detail the way the world would exist in the 21st century, with the age of machines, technology and the loss of humanity. The superb thing is it was recorded in 1984, sixteen years before the time period they wrote about began. Maybe Judas Priest should have written a concept album about their prophecy, at least theirs is undisputable.
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Monday, January 26, 2009 5:10:04 AM 
Okay, I've been listening to Hard Rock and Metal since I was 9, and I've never heard of any band called The Rods.  Can someone fill me in on who these guys were?

I reckon Gary Moore to be an excellent blues-rock guitarist who was very influencial for a lot of the 80's guitar heroes.  I think someone else pointed that out.

Ron, if you listen to Black Sabbath's first two CD's...Black Sabbath & Paranoid, don't you think those 2 discs instantly DEFINE Sabbath as a Metal band?  I agree with your sentiment that Priest started out as Rock but transcended to Metal.  I think that change took place with Sad Wings Of Destiny.  Zep never was Metal and should not be considered as such.  What has Led Zeppelin sung that was ever Metal?  The answer: Nothing!  Kiss isn't Metal either, though they have made Metal discs (some Heavy Metal, some Pop/Glam Metal), but they are basically a Hard Rock band.  There is a fine but distinct line in the sand between Hard Rock and Metal.  The evidence of that is rather plain to see I think.

Edited at: Monday, January 26, 2009 5:19:16 AM
[ron h] Monday, January 26, 2009 4:49:28 AM 
I believe I've heard the rumblings of the Rods possibly putting some new material out...ahhh, the Ramones, one of my favorites of all time,   RIP, fortunately their music is timeless, the very first song my daughter danced to was 'Beat On The Brat', it was cute and funny...I think we all have a tough time with a lot of the opening acts of today, there's nothing to the music anymore (IMHO)...Ok, I've got to get out of the good 'ol days or I'll be for sh#t at work today...Ron
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by flashrockinman from Sunday, January 25, 2009 11:24:42 PM)
[flashrockinman] Sunday, January 25, 2009 11:24:42 PM 
ok,ok i'm showing my age. being that my first concert was queen,  moving pictures tour   rush, mod rules tour  sabbath,  pt. of entry   dah  priest.    killers  maiden , allied forces  triumph  straight between the eye,s   rainbow   blackout tour  scorpions,  saxon, rods,alvin lee,..............even ramones  and that was the college years, in up-state ny.  i do like my rock,  i went to a corn concert this past year..........the warm up bands all sucked.  i really do miss the the old school bands,.    i hear the rods are back together.  if the come home to cortland i'll be there.  i think they are overseas now.   like to hear the feedback      flash
[guitardude] Sunday, January 25, 2009 5:49:13 PM 
The Rods opened for Priest on the SRV tour along with Krokus. At least on the leg I witnessed. The Rods kicked some serious ass!!
David Feinstein (Rods guitarist) had a very thick sound and for a 3 piesce band they were very heavy.
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Sunday, January 25, 2009 7:21:39 AM)
[ron h] Sunday, January 25, 2009 7:21:39 AM 
Wow Flash, you're really going waaaaay back on this...

...Alvin Lee can and HAS played everything from Rock to Swing music...he is one of the most talented musicians ever, but I agree with not being Metal...

...The Rods are Metal for sure, and if I remember right, did't they open for Priest at one one time??...

...Gary Moore is an interesting creature, he has done it all at one time or another and he has influenced many other players such as Randy Rhodes and Kirk Hammet, as well as collaborated with artists such as Ozzy and the Beach Boys, I think he's generally known as a Blues-Rock musician who can do it all!!!...

  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by flashrockinman from Saturday, January 24, 2009 9:50:38 PM)
[flashrockinman] Saturday, January 24, 2009 9:50:38 PM 
yes this thing they call metal?  the rods, metal of course.   I like the topic metal or not metal.  what about alvin lee?  this man can jam.  period.  he's been around since woodstock.  but i consider him hard rock, not metal.  gary moore?  another jammer  he'll blow you away.  1982  dirty fingers.  is he metal     you tell me.   psss.  a hint     i say metal
[ron h] Saturday, January 24, 2009 7:21:53 PM 
I suppose it would be harder for me to differentiate between the 2 if I hadn't been around in that witness the evolution first hand...what I know as Hard Rock from back in the day IS different than what is today considered Hard Rock...same for Metal, some bands considered Metal NOW were at one time Hard can be confusing, I think a lot of it is a generational type me, the differences are like night and day...and you have to consider the entire package of a band in order to categorize doubt Triumph had an edge to them...bands like Priest and Sabbath happened to jump over the edge...what I tell ppl is to listen to British Steel and ANY album of the aforementioned bands back-to-back...the differences you here and feel are the differences between Hard Rock and Metal...bottom line is they ALL rock regardless!!
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by guitardude from Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:47:22 PM)
[guitardude] Saturday, January 24, 2009 6:47:22 PM 
Well said Ron
It`s an evolution thing for sure with many bands. Triumph, had their edge, and like I said before, would be considered a metal band now. But to differentiate(?) between hard rock and metal is a fine line without a doubt.
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Saturday, January 24, 2009 12:29:32 PM)
[guidogodoy] Saturday, January 24, 2009 12:46:32 PM 
Holy Wars, you say? Now THAT is metal! 

  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Saturday, January 24, 2009 12:29:32 PM)
[ron h] Saturday, January 24, 2009 12:29:32 PM 
I am not trying to start a Holy War on what is or is not Metal...instead I will give you how I differentiate between the two (albeit difficult to put into words)...

...Rock music in the late 60's and most of the 70's I consider to be Hard Rock as a precursor to Metal...bands that were on the verge of Metal, but hadn't quite taken the leap (early Priest being in this group).  Granted, some of this early music tries really hard to claim the Metal tag for reasons such as dark lyrics and such (Sabbath and Zep being prime examples of this), but just because a band influences another band and that band transcends into another category doesn't mean that the original band gets to claim the 'new' genre as their own style, just the influence of... any rate, bands like Triumph, Bad Company, Foriegner, Foghat and even KISS are all GREAT bands, they are influences (among many others) to what I consider Metal...

...Metal to me has it's own feel, a look, it's own presence if you's music you can 'bang you're head' to (although not limited to just that)'s a rush of adrenalin that I can't find in any other form of music, although some 'classical' can come close..., there are bands that started out as Hard Rock and eventually morphed into Metal, I consider Sabbath and Priest to fall into this category, but I'm of the opinion that Priest made that transition BEFORE Sabbath (and some others) did...but a band like Triumph, for whatever their reasons, never did...

...this is all my opinion and I'm not trying to claim I'm right and you're wrong or any other non-sense...I respect your opinion!!!...I'm just trying to explain to you mine.

  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Luvers666 from Friday, January 23, 2009 10:03:41 AM)
[Luvers666] Saturday, January 24, 2009 11:23:02 AM 
I am also surprised no one mentioned Ronnie Montrose or Criss Oliva. Ronnie was superb in pioneering a lot of sound while Criss Oliva was the central figure for what proved to be the band that laid the ground work of all Death Metal bands to follow.
[guitardude] Friday, January 23, 2009 11:04:02 AM 
Here`s my take on Triumph being a metal band. Yes, I believe they fit here. Back when they were selling out arenas, metal was an underground music that evolved into what it is today. If Triumph were still around, then yes, they would have evolved into a metal band. With technology running it`s course in the guitar world, it would have been inevitable.
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by ronhartsell from Friday, January 23, 2009 8:13:34 AM)
[Luvers666] Friday, January 23, 2009 10:03:41 AM 

If you wish to put them in 'Hard Rock' than that is your wish but I've said it before and I'll say it yet again that I for one fail to see the difference. Back in the 1970's and 80's, Black Sabbath was, just like nowadays, a Heavy Metal band, yet they were originally called just HARD ROCK.

So in the simplest of terms Hard Rock IS Metal, it may not be Heavy, Death, Speed, Viking, Folk, Pain, Thrash, Brutal, Black or any other bastardized sub-genre or shoot off, but it IS most definately METAL

Besides, how can ANYONE say this is NOT Metal?

Listen to around 2:22, and name me one guitarist who was playing those type of solos in 1972?
If you cannot hear 'Eruption', 'D.O.A.', 'Hell Bent For Leather', 'Call For The Priest', 'Symptom Of The Universe', 'For The Love Of God', 'Ice 9', 'Mr. Crowley' in that(just to name a few), or at least where the influence came from. Then you need an enormous crash course on a history lesson.

Edited at: Friday, January 23, 2009 10:11:25 AM
[ron h] Friday, January 23, 2009 8:13:34 AM 
Very well put...but I personally put Triumph in the Hard Rock category rather than Metal!!
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Luvers666 from Wednesday, January 21, 2009 8:52:26 AM)
[Return_of_Darth_Painkiller_0870] Friday, January 23, 2009 7:30:00 AM 
Wait, you guys mean to say that Triumph is more than 3 weak-ass songs???
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by guitardude from Wednesday, January 21, 2009 2:36:31 PM)
[guitardude] Wednesday, January 21, 2009 2:36:31 PM 

L 666
You are correct on all counts. Rik Emmett is an amazing player. But he flies below radar these days,  I know he has his new signature guitar from Dean, that resembles his old V from Triumph`s heyday.
He, like Glenn and KK , is one of the under appreciated players in the world. But hey! Here`s to a mighty comeback should Rik so desire one.

  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Luvers666 from Wednesday, January 21, 2009 8:52:26 AM)
[Luvers666] Wednesday, January 21, 2009 8:52:26 AM 

I think it is sad that only a totalof six mentions of Rik Emmett was done on all 27 pages of this topic. I began listening to Triumph and Judas Priest the same year, 1978, and they both are tied on several things.

But in terms of ability and influence, rather directly or indirectly, no Metal guitarist is better than Mr. Rik Emmett. All kinds of guitar players you all mentioned have claimed to be influenced by the man, for instance:

Steve Vai - Started playing eclectic guitar because of Rik Emmett
Joe Satriani - Started playing guitar period because of Rik Emmett
Eddie Van Halen - Admitted taking the ideas that are featured on Eruption and Mean Street after watching Rik Emmett(Triumph) play a gig in Canada in 1975, when Van Halen was still called Mammoth
Glenn Tipton - Wrote the Hell Bent For Leather and Call For The Priest solo after listening to Rock And Roll Machine
Dave Murray - Decided to take the punk sounding guitars used by Rik Emmett on Triumph's first two albums, one being Rock And Roll Machine
Randy Rhoads - Found a love for Classical because of Rik Emmett, his two favorite classical pieces are: El Duende Agonizante and Fantasy Serenade.

In 1972 Rik Emmett was in a band called Act III, which was the first time an audience ever got to hear the song Blinding Light Show, which features both shredding on a 12 string classical and 12-string electric, without a break. And the following year Tony Iommi and Black Sabbath recorded Spiral Architect which throughout the song features the same exact rhythm section.

Triumph was the first metal band to ever feature Jazz, Classical, Bluegrass, Waltz, Spanish Flamenco techniques or complete songs. Not to mention their ability to pend songs that were commercial yet heavy, makes them either the inventors or the biggest influence on starting the Glam Metal scene, which rather you like it or not, was a good and lucrative sub genre of Heavy Metal. They were also the first to write a Speed Metal song(Street Fighter Man) while the first to ever write a staple of Metal, light verse to Heavy Metal chorus(Bringing Love To You) and the first ever Punk Metal song(Rock And Roll Machine) which was also the first song to ever have a true Shredding guitar solo.

Triumph also goes down in history as the first ever true Metal band of any kind to release a complete uninteruppted concept album, that was not only loosely based, that album was Thunder Seven, which I highly reccomend to all of you. Plus Rik Emmett was the main songwriter behind all their ideas.

And since what also makes Rik Emmett so amazing is that he has done these genres:

Heavy Metal
Punk Metal
Speed Metal
Thrash Metal
Jazz(Acid, Smooth, 12-bar, arch-top type, swing, acoustic, bar room)
Every form of classical
every form of blues

there is nothing the man is unable to do

[ron h] Sunday, January 11, 2009 7:37:24 AM 
This is a really tough question!!

single-Richie Blackmore

[K2M] Thursday, January 08, 2009 12:51:44 PM 
Yes, And the Music could not stop getting better.   HMMMM.
[guitardude] Tuesday, January 06, 2009 6:16:17 PM 
Randy was  a fire and brimstone player as well, I know that at one time EVH, Lynch and Rhoads were the 3 predominant players in LA. I would have loved to be there to see that scene.

Knucklebonz is releasing a second Randy Rhoads figure soon, this he is playing his polka dot V.
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by K2M from Tuesday, January 06, 2009 4:33:35 PM)
[K2M] Tuesday, January 06, 2009 4:33:35 PM 
Yes, George.    RaNdy Played with Fire
[guitardude] Sunday, January 04, 2009 1:03:24 PM 
You are absolutely correct Tim!!!! Great vid!
  [Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by TIMBONI from Saturday, December 27, 2008 10:19:53 PM)
[metalmaz] Sunday, January 04, 2009 10:49:10 AM 
Jiimy Psge and Michael Schenker
[TIMBONI] Saturday, December 27, 2008 10:19:53 PM 
Nobody plays with the volcanic ferocity of this man. The one and only . . .
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