YOU RANG? LOL!
Reading backwards over the posts of the day, it was the first thing that came to mind when considering "swearing" and "offensive words" (not necessarily one and the same) in most Romance Languages. Spanish, Portuguese, French, Italian all tend to have the heaviest (meaning most offensive) words associated with religion. It also varies from country to country. "Hostia" for example is a pretty innocent one in English. Simply means the "Host" as in Catholic religious ceremonies. Say it in Spain to a grandmother (always my unit of measure) and you'll probably get slapped! However, human sexual organs and acts are usually pretty mild.
I've always thought it curious how English prudes seem to have gotten it "backwards." Then again, I also notice that the same goes for nudity here where I live (heart of the Bible belt). Violence on tv and movies? No trouble. Heaven FORBID you show a boob! Even a mother nursing seems to have people avert their eyes around here.
[Show/Hide Quoted Message] (Quoting Message by Head banger from Saturday, November 29, 2008 6:13:14 PM)| |  | Head banger wrote: | | well, I only realy speak english. but, I know a few words of french, we need guido.
| | | _strat_ wrote: | | Well, more languages... Aside from English, which is a world language, and Slovenian which is my native one, I speak only Serbo-Croat. So, I can say that it holds pretty much true in Slovenian and Serbo-Croat as well as in English. Though I must say that Serbo-Croat has the best swear words. We have taken most of them for our own, infact.
| | | Head banger wrote: | | so, strat, since you speak a more languages that me, does that hold true everywhere? French, the big swears are religious in nature.
| | | _strat_ wrote: | | Ok, Im rewriting this message, because the language filter wouldnt let through my uncensored version (go figure..). So here is my censored version (thanks a lot, Murray. It took me 20 mins to write the uncensored one):
Ok, Ive read this a couple of times, and I think I finaly get what you meant.
While I agree that there is need to "tailor" your language to the audience to make sure that they understand it, I think its quite another to tailor the language to make sure that the audience is not offended by certain words that are deemed "socaily unacceptable".
Practicly ever form of trade, proffesion, education... etc. has its own special expressions that are largely unknown outside of it. If the issue is to tell them in "laymans terms", that is one thing. But we all understand the basic swear words. Again, I dont see any need to omit swearing from ones language.
I mean, swear words are what? References to stuff that is or was a taboo. Sexuality, most obviously. Which is a perfectly normal and common thing. But still, most common expressions for sexual organs or sex are deemed more or less offensive. Or other things, like "shit". Whats more normal than that?
Thats why I dont like it when people get so upset over swearing. Its just words that mostly refer to prefectly normal things. Words wont hurt anyone. They wont kill anyone. They wont make drug addicts out of us. Thats basicly what "obscenity" is all about. Making a fuss about nothing. And thats why I dont have any problem whatesoever with swearing.
Or if we talk about what do we tell about ourselves with the language we use. Well, here it is. I dont mind swearing. Does that alone make me a thug? Hardly. If other people take it that way, well, all I can say is its their problem. Judging others by the language that they use is imo same as judging people by the clothes they wear or music that they listen to. Its really much more complicated than that.
Now... I may have strayed from the discussion a bit, but here is my point, as good as it gets.
| | | Deep Freeze wrote: | | Good Morning, boys and girls! Sometime around half past four here in Las Vegas and we are ready for our latest edition of Insomniac Theater! I see we have had considerable discussion regarding our last topic, profanity. Well done! As was expected, our rather verbose classmate strat has raised some challenging issues and we should address this in our own, special way. Please follow along and prepare to review;
Last time, we talked about profanity's effect on others as well as it's place, if any, in our language. After much discussion, I am compelled to address this debate thusly: Just what does the writer owe to the hypothetical reader? And what, in all good conscience, does a writer owe to himself? These questions concern not only the professional writer, but certainly the writer here among us as well as everyone that writes a letter, speaks to a group or attempts to teach an adolescent a life-lesson. The true purpose of language to to convey a message from writer to reader or from speaker to auditor. And the first requirement is a common language.
It is among the most enduring fascinations of speech that everyone, in some fashion, is a linguist. I know my daughter speaks fluent "computerese". I speak fairly good "finance". Doctors tend to be rather fluent in "medicine" and we all know people that speak "sports". In our daily lives, we tailor our communication to the audience. Most professional writers tend to communicate to their audience as if they are all high school graduates in their most perceptive moments. Some may write to a "higher" audience but, we must resist the temptation to "dumb down" our writing, lest we insult our reader. Afterall, we are not children here, are we? In any event, no one wishes to be spoken to in a condescending manner. Conversely, it is unwise to fire our bolts of wisdom over their heads! Of course, an occasional reference to something otherwise not considered "common knowledge" is a great way to inform the curious reader and should not be avoided.
I tend to believe that the manner in which we write or speak tells others a lot about who we are as a person. Not so much our social status or our worth as a human being. I should think that even the very best among the human race resort to an occasional "F"-bomb, as it were. When I mentioned earlier that I feel it cheapens the message, I was referring to the fact that there are certainly far better ways to express or emphasize a point than turning to an obscene word or two. As I also mentioned previously, I have employed a rather "randy" comment or ten in my lifetime. Again, the point is that I tailor my words to fit my audience. More importantly, I look to ensure that my message meets my standards of deceny. Hmm..perhaps deceny should be on our agenda for a future conversation? HA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Edited at: Saturday, November 29, 2008 7:15:01 AM |
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